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T O P I C     R E V I E W
beachcat	Could this be a common question, now that our cars are getting older? I saw this current ebayer had this to say regarding the timing belt. Using it as a marketing tool: "This is a major service and one that will be required on ALL prowlers regardless of miles. The belt is rubber and begins to breakdown over time. Don't let other sellers fool you into think this is optional as the 1999 - 2002 prowler engine is an impact engine which means the engine will be damaged with the belt breaks."
alrtg	Given that it appears the advertiser uses the incorrect terminology for the "Interference" design used in the 1999-2002 cars, I would tend to say they know not what they are speaking of. On the other hand I am sure time will play a role in the durability of the belts regardless of miles. With that said, it would be up to the individual owner to thoroughly research the subject first, then evaluate their comfort level before making any decision. JMO
beachcat	Here is an interesting thread of people who seem to know what they are talking about. http://community.cartalk.com/discussion/782813/low-mileage-can-trump-age-when-deciding-on-timing-belt-replacement What I get from them is that low mileage, well treated cars, like ours, will have a greater grace period. But, If recommended average changeout times are 7 to 9 years, we have already doubled that with our cars.
beachcat	Can we have a poll of who has done their timing belts. At what approximate mileage and if possible, the approximate cost of the job?
jimsutton	Wondering if any Prowlers have every had a Timing belt problem ??? I know they are getting old but belts can last a long time and I know of cars/Trucks with over 200.000 Thousand miles and over 20 yrs. old with out a problem so I think it is . Dam if I do or DAM if I don't --- I am not worried about mine with 60.000 miles on it at this time ..
DON WIEBER	what kind of money are we talking about for the dealer to do the job?
stevedymo	This thread belongs in Technical Q and A. Do a search on 'timing belt' and see all the talk on this subject.
beachcat	I think padroo did it himself. Dale can you chime in on the difficulty of this job? Any special tools required? Did you follow the big purpl prowler manual?
padroo	Yes I did it myself. If you have ever changed one on another car you should have no trouble with the Prowler. I would reccomend using the three jaw puller the manual reccomends to remove the harmonic balancer. I had several and none were the right length for the job. There is also a harmonic installation tool that I improvised and worked, nothing nothing special just some all thread, flat washers, a nut and a tack weld. . If you plan on doing this yourself I had an earlier post with detailed instructions. This is a good time to change radiator hoses and flush your cooling system while you have the radiator out and install new belts. This message has been edited by padroo on 05-11-2015 at 09:40 AM
beachcat	quote: Originally posted by padroo: If you plan on doing this yourself I had an earlier post with detailed instructions. How did I miss that? Dale do you have a link for that?
padroo	I copied my post from 2011. I will see if I can find the pictures and add them later. The big purple book tells the whole procedure but it's always the little things that get you in trouble. Having the right puller was my big one. The only pictures I took were of the Harmonic Balancer. I had trouble removing it but after I got the right tool it came right off. If you follow the book you should not have any problem except for some details that should be added when installing the belt. If you have installed a timing belt before it is fairly straight forward. I have worked on some that did not have the room the Prowler has. I know it looks tight but after you take off the radiator support and the serpentine belt and v belt there is plenty of room. I would suggest putting the car up on ramps, you will need the room to work under the car to do v belt tensioning and tensioning the timing belt. This is the procedure to install the timing belt that I used. Locate the cam gear timing marks and the one on the crankshaft. Rotate the crankshaft to align all three marks. Then remove the tensioner from the engine and remove the belt. Starting from the crankshaft gear, install the belt working in a counterclockwise direction. Tip: jam something under the belt under the crankshaft gear so the belt will not slip off its gear. Next, go around the drivers side cam gear with your belt. You have to make sure it is tight between the crankshaft and the first cam gear. Tip: Rotate the cam gear just enough so you can get the belt on the cam gear then rotate it back to the timing mark and make sure it is tight and on the timing marks. Tip: This is very high tech, take two cloths pins and clip them to the cam gear to hold the new belt in the cam gear and still tight and on the timing marks. Next install the back side of the belt around the water pump and then to the next cam gear. Using the same procedure of rotating the cam gear slightly then putting the belt on the cam gear then rotating back making sure there is no slack between the cam gear, water pump and first cam gear. Install two more clothes pins to hold it in place. Now look at what you have, all three timing marks should be in time and there should be no slack until you get to the other side of the second cam gear. Install the cam gear around the tensioner and the belt is in place. Take the tensioning device and compress the plunger in a very large vice. There are alignment holes that will line up and I used a small allen wrench to hold the plunger and removed the tension from the vice. Install the tensioner with the two bolts and torque to specs. Remove the allen wrench with force and it will put tension on the new belt for the first time. Check your three timing marks, then rotate the crankshaft two full revolutions and stop the crankshaft timing mark on TDC. The cam timing marks should be lined up also, you are done. If you keep the belt tight and the marks in alignment you will get it the first time. Pat yourself on the back! Don't forget to remove the clothes pins and blocking under the crankshaft gear. I had to buy 96 clothes pins and only needed four. Now if I can convince my wife to hang the laundry out to dry I am in good shape! Miller tool #6792 to install harmonic ballancer. http://www.toolsource.com/crank-sprocket-installer-chrysler-jeep-dodge-p-99112.html . . Homemade Harmonic Balancer Installation Tool. You can't use the bolt to pull the harmonic balancer back on because it is too short and if it were you need to thread it all the way into the crankshaft to keep from stripping the threads. After installation torque the bolt to specs, metric threads. . . . . . . . http://www.amazon.com/OTC-Mechanical-Grip-O-Matic-Puller-Reversible/dp/B0002SRFN0 . . I had a bunch of three jaw pullers and it has to be a three jaw because of the way the harmonic balancer is made. It is a tight squeeze to get a puller just the right length to fit between the harmonic balancer and the condenser. Don't try to pull it from the outside edge, you will ruin the harmonic balancer by damaging the outer rim where the belt runs and it is set in rubber for dampening purposes. . . . . . . This is a picture of the backside of the harmonic balancer and the black arrow points to one of the three places where the jaws of the 3 jaw puller make contact to start the pulling process. Don't forget to protect the crankshaft threads by whatever means necessary to keep from damaging the threads. . . . CAUTION, CAUTION, CAUTION 1999's and up had interference engines. If you turn the crankshaft or cams independent of each other you run the risk of bending a valve because these are interference engines. The purple book mentions it but be careful, you have been warned. This message has been edited by padroo on 05-11-2015 at 02:19 PM
beachcat	Thanks Dale. I might give it a try next winter. What about the water pump? Did you do it also?
padroo	I had to stop somewhere and the car only had 7,000 miles but it would have been easy being I was in the neighborhood.