posted 04-18-2003 12:51 PM         

The mechanic noticed the upper ball joint was "sticky" and he thought it should be replaced. We both noticed wear on the upper A-arm and the steering knuckle, in fact the two parts were rubbing each other with the car up on the lift. There was zero clearance at or near full suspension travel, and the parts had obviously been rubbing each other during normal driving.

What apparently happened is this: The ball joint has a tapered pin, which we don't like to use in aerospace design due to the really tight tolerance of the tapered hole, which in this case is in the steering knuckle. The tapered pin is steel, the steering knuckle is aluminum. If the nut is over-torqued, the tapered steel pin will expand the tapered hole in the steering knuckle, pulling the steering knuckle farther up onto the shaft of the pin, and causing the two parts to interfere with each other. Or, if the hole or pin taper dimensions are not just right, the parts may be assembled with the steering knuckle farther up on the shaft, also resulting in interference. Both the steering knuckle and upper A-arm should be replaced.

posted 04-21-2003 10:30 AM         

This is all starting to become a Pandora's box of problems with this damn front end. What is supposed to be a simple recall is opening up so many more problems and things to worry about.

posted 04-21-2003 04:44 PM         

quote:

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Originally posted by Black Tie 161:
DC already cut corners by making the ball joints removeable! As long as they didn't have to make 24,000 A-arms, right? They devised a system that, at best will scratch your control arms. But I bet if I looked close enough...I could find some scratches.

They make this car as a specialty vehicle, and trot it out to all the shows, but DC now treats the car like a red-headed step child and the Neon gets more support from the manufacturer at this point.

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Maybe I'm missing something here but I don't see that DC cut any corners at all. The ball joints were the problem, not the control arms. In fact I would not be happy if DC had decided to cahnge my smooth finished arms over to the rough cast. My Chrome A-arm covers would also no longer fit.
It seems to me that DC realized a problem and offered a realistic solution to the problem.

The sytem devised to change the ball joints is not the problem. There are no scratches at all on my control arms or chrome covers. Sloppy or irresponsible and untrained mechanics are the problem. This is not DC's fault either. Talk to your dealer about any damage.

DC has designed and offered the correct tools and instructions to do the job correctly.
My own car has no problems and the tech even devised a way to do the recall without my needing to take my chrome covers off. That's what a good mechanic will do. He'll survey the situation and plan his approach before making the needed modifications or repairs.

I'll bet if you look closely enough you will be able to find fault with almost anything.
This is the real world, not a perfect one.
People and dealers make mistakes and when that happens, they need to do their best to make them right again. Why condemn the manufacturer for an error made by an imperfect human being that was only doing what he thought to be correct?

A red headed step child?
The Prowler was a short run car from inception! Just how long do you think the parts should be available for a car no longer produced? I'm sure one of the reasons you purchased your car was because you felt it quite unique and maybe even hoped that after production ceased, it may even just possibly become more valuable. They can't be rare and unique or appreciate in value if still in production or as long as every part is readily available.

There is nothing on a Prowler that cannot be duplicated by a talented craftsman. It's just paint, it's just a machine, it's just a car, and it's a beautiful work of art, but it's to bad that you feel that you were slighted in some way.

I personally am happy to have had the chance to purchase a car like the Prowler in the first place.
Try building one for the price you paid.

Oh yeah!
Don't forget that it has to be perfect in every way or you won't be happy!

posted 04-21-2003 05:07 PM         

I had my ball joints replaced today. They did a marvelous job. I noticed a small scratch in each fender, which I'm pretty sure I can buff out myself, and one small scratch on the left-sides lower A-arm. All-in-all nothing much to complain about for having a safe car to ride in.

posted 04-21-2003 08:43 PM         

I'm very satisfied with the work on my car and HAPPY as H*LL they didn't change the a-arms. I have the coated ones and do not want the rough cast. There was nothing wrong with the control arm and as I stated in another post 99.9% of all cars built have ball joints that are replaceable. This is GOOD news for those like Marty that uses his car as a daily driver and might wear the ball joints out due to the driving he does.

I did take pictures before I took it in and told them I expected to have the car back without any scratches

If there is any damage as this thread indicates, it should be checked and noted on service order, just in case.

posted 04-22-2003 07:29 AM         

Personally I am happy with my service and I do not cry over every little scratch on my daily driver Prowler. But there is still a part of me that thinks DC cheesed out on the recall. Larry, You ARE RIGHT on the one hand, as it is a great convenience to people with custom treated arms and won't harm them if performed properly. It just seems the procedure that DC endorsed opened up a whole new set of problems for a lot of people who had the recall performed wrong. IS that DC's fault or the individual mechanic who screwed it up? Of course it's the mechanic, and DC can't do much more than write an explicit set of instructions for the procedure and provide the tools.

I didn't mean for my previous post to come off as whiny. Just venting.....The Prowler could be a big POS and I would stil love it.

My Point? I forget now...

BTW: Larry, the only thing I would disagree with you on is where you asked how long I would expect a manufacturer to supply parts for a discontinued car. Doesn't the law state that they have to supply spare parts 7 (or 10?) years after production stopped?? We should not be begging for center caps, mud flaps, and heaven forbid, more important parts unique to the car. Everything seems to be on back-order. Not being able to find spare parts does not make the car any rarer or more unique....There are only just under 12,000 made and that will never change. As unique as the car is, it still was a production vehicle, and DC has a responsibility to have parts readily available for at least 7 years....Or is it 10? help me out here folks...

posted 04-22-2003 01:29 PM         

My mechanic did a good job. He used the same tool shown in the picture above - however, the tool won't completely remove the ball joint, it has to be tapped out the final distance. The driver's side on my Prowler was very difficult to remove and took heavy hammering to complete the removal. Just unlucky, but the tool could have been better.

Also, regardless of "why" the lower ball joint is replaced and not the whole A-arm on the recall (pro's and con's depending on your situation), the fact is the whole A-arm was meant to be replaced. Don't believe me? Try to order a ball joint only, you'll be required to order the A-arm assembly. The upper ball joint on my Prowler is going to be replaced as noted and the mechanic had to order the whole upper A-arm with the ball joint, couldn't get the ball joint by itself. This is going to require some major disassembly to remove one of the A-arm bolts that is blocked by the pushrod, which requires removing the pushrod (which is attached to the coil-over shock), and removing exterior panels to get access to the pushrod bolt.

posted 04-22-2003 01:57 PM         

Like I said the Prowler could be the biggest POS on the road, but I'll keep driving and loving it....I just get paranoid sometimes that my daily driver could go out of commission if something goes wrong and parts are backordered. Yes it is crazy to have the car as a daily driver, but it is still a mass production car!!!

It's cool record and Larry...

posted 04-22-2003 03:35 PM         

BT,
I didn't mean to make it sound like I was mad at you. I was just trying to catch this at the start instead of letting it get blown out of proportion.

There are many people on this board who believe everything they read here. While there is a tremendous amount of good information here, there is also some that isn't very accurate. I'm pretty senistive about the opinions that are posted as facts.
Many of our members have little or no mechanical experience. Sometimes their only option is to believe what they are told or read on this site.

Peace!

posted 04-22-2003 04:05 PM         

WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!

quote:

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Originally posted by Black Tie 161:
...not shooting the messenger

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Why not, there's enough shots being taken at you.

quote:

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the Prowler could be the biggest POS on the road

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Hush your mouth. You can't even THINK that - the thought-police will get you!

quote:

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Yes it is crazy to have the car as a daily driver

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You obviously didn't read the brochure before buying:

- Prowler provides affordable, durable, and stylish pure transportational function
- It can be serviced at any Chrysler dealership
- Prowler is a luxury car by hot-rodding standards. Here's a tightly-sealed cabriolet . . . (with top) that is easily dropped or raised
- No other hotrod anywhere combines the contemporary engineering and commodious creature comfort that Prowler does. For sure, no other rodney complies with federal passenger car safety standards

How can you argue with that?

pure transportational function - service at any Chrysler dealership - tightly-sealed - top easily dropped or raised - modern engineering - commodious creature comfort - meets federal safety standards.

It's OBVIOUSLY a daily driver.

-GRROWL

P.S. - GRROWL is virtually a daily driver.

P.P.S. - I LOVE the car!

P.P.P.S. - "It's never too late to have a happy childhood"

P.P.P.P.S. - My dealer is GRReat!

posted 04-23-2003 11:32 AM         

GRROWL: LMFAO!!! Someone take the brochure away from GRROWL..quickly!!!

But.....the one thing that irks me in the brochure is looking at the pic where the Prowler is going through the "rain shower" booth. Now with so many leaking top problems, exactly what WAS the slop tolerance they allowed to pass the car on that test?

"Uhhh....there is only a gallon of water on the seat."
"Well, it passed the rain test....NEXT!"